• The GiftBot 2.0 Launch Giveaway Extravaganza has come to a close with an astounding 8073 games given away to the community by 696 members, a huge success thanks to you! The gifting now continues with more official prizes in the new Gaming Giveaways |OT|. Leftover Steam codes are also being given away to the PC Gaming Era community.

Non-Binary |OT| 01101110 01101111 01101110

milkyway

Member
May 17, 2018
1,252
1. What are your pronouns?
He/him for now, not sure I feel I need to change this I could go with anything but I'm male by birth and present as such

2. How do you like to describe your gender / identity? Are there any terms, identities, or affinities you like to evoke in describing yourself?
Non-binary works, although I probably have a slight male slant

3. In your experience, does being non-binary feel like having no gender, many genders, fluctuating genders, or both / neither?
None, I feel my personality is fairly divorced from masculinity or femininity for the most part, with some flourishes of both

4. What's your favorite thing about being non-binary? What's your least favorite? What's something that has surprised you?
See question 6

5. Has any people, media, art, music, etc. inspired your non-binary self-actualization? If so please share & feel free to elaborate!
Probably David Bowie to an extent

6. Is there anything else you'd like to share or say?
This is the first time I'm even acknowledging this to anyone other than myself because I really don't even know how to bring this up to anyone right now. I came out publicly as bisexual years ago and realized asexual was more in-line with what I felt, coming out with that to a few friends. Being non-binary is another one of those things I can look back to my past self and easily see how my personality and interests weren't very connected with most definitions of masculinity/femininity. I was socially anxious and spent some middle school and most of my high school years trying to fit in with other boys - trying to adopt more masculine interests and mannerisms. I never really fit in, and eventually realized that trying to force these things on myself was stupid and caused a lot of depression. It's only within the past year I started thinking more about being non-binary because I've grown to a point in my life where I'm more comfortable with who I am and examining that sort of thing, but I still have that "how do I really know" sort of thing going on so yea.

So I guess I'm at a point of "what now" with this, how to approach close friends/family, what this will mean romantically (I'm not aromantic and I have also never been in a relationship), and I'm just not ready to talk to anyone I know about it (although part of me would like to cannonball this shit like I did with the bisexual coming out) so I'm posting here and feel free to say a thing to a sort of confused person ok thanks for reading!
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
This was awesome to see:


Blanche is one of the three team leaders and was specifically designed to be gender ambiguous, has only been referred to by name and the latest canon blog post uses they/them pronouns for them.

Spark:
Unfortunately, we had some...unexpected testing by our rambunctious Team Instinct Leader, Spark.

After his unauthorized testing, and a bit of reprimanding, Spark shared with me yet another unexpected encounter.
Spark told me that Sierra’s presence seemed different from the Grunts he’d encountered. He wasn’t intimidated by Team GO Rocket Grunts, but he felt small in Sierra’s presence.
Candela:

Blanche:
Spark returned the Rocket Radar, which was still malfunctioning after Blanche’s adjustments. Blanche was obviously not amused by the adventures of a fellow team leader, but realized his use of the prototype provided additional insights into what could be causing the malfunction.
Blanche became visibly upset, which tends to happen when things don’t go to their carefully curated plans. This was when something unexpected happened.




1. What are your pronouns?
He/him for now, not sure I feel I need to change this I could go with anything but I'm male by birth and present as such

2. How do you like to describe your gender / identity? Are there any terms, identities, or affinities you like to evoke in describing yourself?
Non-binary works, although I probably have a slight male slant

3. In your experience, does being non-binary feel like having no gender, many genders, fluctuating genders, or both / neither?
None, I feel my personality is fairly divorced from masculinity or femininity for the most part, with some flourishes of both

4. What's your favorite thing about being non-binary? What's your least favorite? What's something that has surprised you?
See question 6

5. Has any people, media, art, music, etc. inspired your non-binary self-actualization? If so please share & feel free to elaborate!
Probably David Bowie to an extent

6. Is there anything else you'd like to share or say?
This is the first time I'm even acknowledging this to anyone other than myself because I really don't even know how to bring this up to anyone right now. I came out publicly as bisexual years ago and realized asexual was more in-line with what I felt, coming out with that to a few friends. Being non-binary is another one of those things I can look back to my past self and easily see how my personality and interests weren't very connected with most definitions of masculinity/femininity. I was socially anxious and spent some middle school and most of my high school years trying to fit in with other boys - trying to adopt more masculine interests and mannerisms. I never really fit in, and eventually realized that trying to force these things on myself was stupid and caused a lot of depression. It's only within the past year I started thinking more about being non-binary because I've grown to a point in my life where I'm more comfortable with who I am and examining that sort of thing, but I still have that "how do I really know" sort of thing going on so yea.

So I guess I'm at a point of "what now" with this, how to approach close friends/family, what this will mean romantically (I'm not aromantic and I have also never been in a relationship), and I'm just not ready to talk to anyone I know about it (although part of me would like to cannonball this shit like I did with the bisexual coming out) so I'm posting here and feel free to say a thing to a sort of confused person ok thanks for reading!
Welcome! I'll say that it's ok to be confused and for your identity to be coloured in as you explore gender and what suits you. Realising you're not a part of the binary and breaking from that is incredibly affirming but it also leaves you floating in space a bit as everything up until that point has been so rigidly defined. Just give yourself the freedom and time to find yourself within it.
 
Last edited:

i love tacos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
38
Wow that’s fantastic! Im so glad they are a person and not a robot or monster. It may not be a player character but I’ll take it. Can’t wait to play!

Oh yeah, I experienced this in spades. I even got, "I hope this phase ends eventually" from my father. That was maybe two years now? Lol. They've also given up on talking about it.
In fact, that was perhaps the most extreme for them, cause now anything else I do that deviates from gender norms goes unnoticed, e.g., my hair, my nails, conservative use of makeup. I haven't really pushed much further though.



I don't disagree, but in my friend's case, it really comes from a place of bigotry. He's a conservative evangelical, and has made disparaging comments about queer folks in the past. He's toned it down since he learned his brother is bi, and since his views have put him at odds with the rest of our group. But I know his attitude hasn't changed, he's simply doing what he must in order to remain peaceable.
Oof, you have my sympathies. I grew up in the Evangelical community, that is very familiar. I am glad to hear they are at least somewhat accommodating for you.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Sad but unsurprising that some gamers™ are feeling some type of way over Blanche being non-binary. Now claiming developers said they were a woman at SDCC. Which, y’know, is a load of nonsense as you’d expect.

Even the gaming-side thread here has a good helping of ‘grasping at straws’:
 
Last edited:

Tezz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,055
Sad but unsurprising that some gamers™ are feeling some type of way over Blanche being non-binary. Now claiming developers said they were a woman at SDCC. Which, y’know, is a load of nonsense as you’d expect.

Even the gaming-side thread here has a good helping of ‘grasping at straws’:
Compared to other recent gender related threads, that Blanche thread is surprisingly tame. I was mentally preparing myself for worse.

Edit: I don't say that to minimize those comments, or anything. Just somewhat relieving.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Compared to other recent gender related threads, that Blanche thread is surprisingly tame. I was mentally preparing myself for worse.

Edit: I don't say that to minimize those comments, or anything. Just somewhat relieving.
Not at all - you’re right, though I’ll bite my tongue at being grateful for the few there. I’m sure it not having gained much traction is a contributing factor.

It’s mainly that they’ve only ever used their name or they/them pronouns to refer to Blanche yet people throw out non-binary as being clutching at straws which inherently assumes a binary as the sensible default. Seems wilfully ignorant to not understand the context of the two other leaders having been referred to as he/him and she/her while specifically only using Blanche’s name or they/them pronouns.

People have meltdowns if anything trans or non-binary is presented loud and proud in a game and then when it’s landed as normal and unremarkable in-universe it’s suddenly back to ‘clutching at straws’.
 
Last edited:

Mewn

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,111
UK
I wonder if they should casually slip that yes, Blanche is enby and everyone should deal with it.

I think the intention is clear but so long as there's this grey area where people can twist themselves into knots in some inverse Occam's Razor where the simplest explanation cannot possibly be true, this is gonna happen.

And it turns what should be nice low-key representation into tiresome arguing. It sucks.
 

KojiKnight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,360
Not at all - you’re right, though I’ll bite my tongue at being grateful for the few there. I’m sure it not having gained much traction is a contributing factor.

It’s mainly that they’ve only ever used their name or they/them pronouns to refer to Blanche yet people throw out non-binary as being clutching at straws which inherently assumes a binary as the sensible default. Seems wilfully ignorant to not understand the context of the two other leaders having been referred to as he/him and she/her while specifically only using Blanche’s name or they/them pronouns.

People have meltdowns if anything trans or non-binary is presented loud and proud in a game and then when it’s landed as normal and unremarkable in-universe it’s suddenly back to ‘clutching at straws’.
It's almost like they are playing life like it's a game where trans and enby people aren't allowed even a small win.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,707
I'm just gonna ramble for a bit. This might be steam of consciousness...

It feels like every time I start to feel comfortable about my identity I start doubting myself. Like first I go back and forth on whether I feel right calling myself non-binary because I don't feel any dysphoria or any real desire to present differently. Then I start fretting over my pronouns because I like they/them on characters and such, and seeing it makes me feel good so why don't I just be he/they? Then I feel like maybe I'm just they/them and I'm making up excuses to cling to he/him because it's so convenient to use and I'd only have to come out to people I want to, which is complicated by the fact that I really don't want to be openly non-binary in public, and right now he/him feels like my armor that lets me feel like I can fit in and still be true to myself.

I used to think of myself as being in between male and agender on the spectrum, but I'm sick of trying to place myself on a spectrum. I'm sick of thinking about what my gender identity is. I'm sick of fretting about my pronouns. I don't even want a gender anymore. Maybe that makes me agender but I don't care. I only want to think of myself as just me. I don't even want to set non-binary on my profile on here. The only reason non-binary feels right to me is because it feels like an umbrella. Is this what it feels like for people who say to use any pronoun with them? All I really know is that she/her isn't me, and I don't want to care about anything else. I can just say he and they are both fine and I don't care which.
 

Lozange

Member
Oct 25, 2017
500
I'm just gonna ramble for a bit. This might be steam of consciousness...

It feels like every time I start to feel comfortable about my identity I start doubting myself. Like first I go back and forth on whether I feel right calling myself non-binary because I don't feel any dysphoria or any real desire to present differently. Then I start fretting over my pronouns because I like they/them on characters and such, and seeing it makes me feel good so why don't I just be he/they? Then I feel like maybe I'm just they/them and I'm making up excuses to cling to he/him because it's so convenient to use and I'd only have to come out to people I want to, which is complicated by the fact that I really don't want to be openly non-binary in public, and right now he/him feels like my armor that lets me feel like I can fit in and still be true to myself.

I used to think of myself as being in between male and agender on the spectrum, but I'm sick of trying to place myself on a spectrum. I'm sick of thinking about what my gender identity is. I'm sick of fretting about my pronouns. I don't even want a gender anymore. Maybe that makes me agender but I don't care. I only want to think of myself as just me. I don't even want to set non-binary on my profile on here. The only reason non-binary feels right to me is because it feels like an umbrella. Is this what it feels like for people who say to use any pronoun with them? All I really know is that she/her isn't me, and I don't want to care about anything else. I can just say he and they are both fine and I don't care which.
First of all: don't worry. This is a big mood tbh. You're not alone here, I can confirm that myself, with a couple of minor details changed. (I *do* have my pronouns as he/him and they/them in places, but I still go back and forth over what I want people to call me. Maybe this is a little gender fluidy for me personally? Idk)

The line of thought that I always go back to is, "cis people don't worry about their gender". That you're worrying about this is pretty strong evidence that you're non binary in broadest, umbrella...iest, sense of the term.

As for how you present, here's the thing: femininity takes effort. You apply makeup. You shave your legs and whatever. You grow your hair out and maintain it at long lengths. And if you're not AFAB, you go against societal expectations. Logically speaking, ignoring gender? Why would you.
Masculinity by comparison is a lot more... Well, in extreme versions, you have to go to the gym and get super buff, but otherwise wear a male clothes? And if you're AMAB, that's pretty much it.

Masculinity and femininity are not equal and opposite to each other, especially depending on what you have naturally. If you're agender like you suggest (and that sounds possible to me!), breaking out of the male role is a lot of effort for something you might not necessarily be interested in. Don't do it just so you can have a "Nonbinary aesthetic" and thus feel more part of the community, you shouldn't have to do that. Gender is more than physical presentation.

You *could* change how you present, and you have complicated feelings on it. But you choose not to! Valid.
 
Last edited:

JKuch

Member
Oct 25, 2017
518


Shittily taken picture for shittily done nails 😢
Always wanted to do it, I'm slowly trying out stuff, still not out to anyone of my friends/family too so doing this kind of thing can be difficult. 😭
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Which thread this time? At this point I can't even bother opening some threads anymore, I get too frustrated.
Nice nails, I'm glad you're finding some time to explore things you want to do.

As for the thread, this bonfire:
 

JKuch

Member
Oct 25, 2017
518
That looks way better than my first attempt JKuch 😀
Nice nails, I'm glad you're finding some time to explore things you want to do.

As for the thread, this bonfire:
Thanks for the compliments!😍
 

i love tacos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
38
Sup y’all. Friday tomorrow 🙌


Paper:
Thanks for sharing. Not surprising that we’re an afterthought for tech companies.

If they do manage to fix this, I can’t say I’m comfortable with the possibility of being outed by an ad, but that’s something I’d have to navigate myself.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Thanks for sharing. Not surprising that we’re an afterthought for tech companies.

If they do manage to fix this, I can’t say I’m comfortable with the possibility of being outed by an ad, but that’s something I’d have to navigate myself.
Definitely left in the wake of whatever dream surveillance tool they come up with. Terrifying the situations it could suddenly thrust you into if it has a hiccup.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Natalie Wynn responded, thoughts below that too.

For those who were waiting for Natalie’s response to the Buck Angel controversy, she’s done so in a stream for those subbed to her Patreon. Here is a transcript.

It’s bad.
Could just stop talking about and tripping up over non-binary people and not invite people that don’t think we exist onto Contrapoints. Doesn’t seem that difficult and though I empathise with the bombardment she’s faced directly I find it hard to buy this “damned if I do, damned if I don’t” act when the latter hasn’t actually been attempted.

I wish her no ill-will but can’t personally support her in what she’s going for anymore. The few stumbles before were irritating but you know, there’s a lot of pressure and she’s growing etc. Then Buck Angel happened and it was shitty, and now most of this. The “oh dear, poor Buck” segment? Effectively the first half? Nah lol. I’m good.

Don’t moan about the extremes when you appeal to them either. He’s not a supervillain, he’s an asshole that thinks people like me shouldn’t exist. He doesn’t need to be anything more than that to warrant the reaction he gets.
 

Tezz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,055
I saw CaseyExplosion's twitter thread where she recommended Gender Outlaw, and someone in the replies recommended Stone Butch Blues (which came with a sexual violence content warning). Does anyone here know of any other good books on the subject?
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
I saw CaseyExplosion's twitter thread where she recommended Gender Outlaw, and someone in the replies recommended Stone Butch Blues (which came with a sexual violence content warning). Does anyone here know of any other good books on the subject?
It’s a good thread, will post here for others.
Also interested re: the books.
As someone a couple of years off 40, who was disregarding the gender binary as a child in the Eighties, that whole shebang just makes me facepalm.
It’s total revisionist bullshit and it’s far from the first time she’s tried to push it.
 

KojiKnight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,360
Quoting this from the Persona 5 homophobia thread, just because I had no idea that the Yakuza games were so progressive on this, and it shows the "Japan is just socially different and that's just how it is" excuses are just that. Stupid insensitive bullshit excuses.


REMEMBER THAT THE YAKUZA TEAM REMOVED THE TRANSPHOBIC ELEMENTS FROM YAKUZA 3 DURING THE RE-RELEASE CAUSE THEY KNEW IT WAS GROSS AND OFFENSIVE

AND THEY ALSO GAVE US THIS

Useful image to post when future inevitable examples happen on gaming side.
 

JKuch

Member
Oct 25, 2017
518
Quoting this from the Persona 5 homophobia thread, just because I had no idea that the Yakuza games were so progressive on this, and it shows the "Japan is just socially different and that's just how it is" excuses are just that. Stupid insensitive bullshit excuses.




Useful image to post when future inevitable examples happen on gaming side.
Holy fuck I'm gonna cry, I hadn't seen that dialogue from Yakuza, that's fucking amazing.
 

Tezz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,055
Huh. I don't step into gaming side ever often these days, so I was completely unaware of this. I play video games very infrequently, but Yakuza 0 and Persona 5 were both titles I was still interested in getting. However, it seems my backlog will only be increasing by one. And I totally forgot about the Catherine stuff too. I don't need Atlus in my life anymore.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Being told that no, actually, SJW is a term that's used in pride now by the left so don't be thinking Queen Wynn is using it nastily when she's there blaming people for virtue signalling and wanting safe spaces 🙄

This “old vs young” stance isn't an accident either, it's a recurring thing she does and it's literally fake news. It's rewriting history to give herself a buffer for ignorance, and then extending that out to some of the more vile people out there.

It stokes a divide that isn't even there and positions herself as some bridge between it. It throws older pioneers of gender under the bus to frame the issue as older ignorance. Positioning the young against them instead of herself or the hateful people she's associated with.
Quoting this from the Persona 5 homophobia thread, just because I had no idea that the Yakuza games were so progressive on this, and it shows the "Japan is just socially different and that's just how it is" excuses are just that. Stupid insensitive bullshit excuses.

Useful image to post when future inevitable examples happen on gaming side.
This is legitimately great to see, thank you for sharing it. As you say, blows a hole in the "but Japan" argument. I've not actually played a Yakuza game yet so this might be a great place to start.

Tho let's be real, still trying to get Outer Wilds out of the backlog and we have Death Stranding and Pokémon coming up. Still haven't finished Link's Awakening or Fire Emblem, or Astral Chain, Daemon X Machina and.. arghh why is gaming so damn good right now lol.
 
Last edited:

lucebuce

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,836
Pakistan
Useful image to post when future inevitable examples happen on gaming side.
Just another point about Yakuza, Nagoshi (head of the series, Chief Creative Offer for SEGA) is close friends with a transgender TV hostess/media personality and they host a stream about every month where they talk about SEGA's upcoming stuff and also bring on famous directors or comedians and musicians to talk about their stuff. Basically, they're not afraid to let transgender folk be part of the official face of the company. And also this:

 

Lozange

Member
Oct 25, 2017
500
I *have* heard that Yakuza 0 still isn't perfect, but even from the outside (I need to play 0 too lol) you can still see a clear progression over the past few games of actively getting better, culminating in the above in...I think it's Kiwami 2? And removing a bad sidequest tm in the Yakuza 3 remaster. There's a lot to be said for devs who actually trying?
Certainly doing better than Atlus at least. Atlus more like BADLUS
 

lucebuce

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,836
Pakistan
I *have* heard that Yakuza 0 still isn't perfect, but even from the outside (I need to play 0 too lol) you can still see a clear progression over the past few games of actively getting better, culminating in the above in...I think it's Kiwami 2? And removing a bad sidequest tm in the Yakuza 3 remaster. There's a lot to be said for devs who actually trying?
Certainly doing better than Atlus at least. Atlus more like BADLUS
The problems the series has had regarding transphobia are mainly found in Yakuza 3 and 4, and they've been actively getting better in that regard ever since. The main problem that the series has had and in some ways continues to have is strangely enough, the issue of a large focus on machismo. Male characters make up 90% of the cast of almost ALL Yakuza games and while the protagonists are always painted as these paragons of virtue, all other characters tend to treat women quite poorly (the villains in particular).

Considering the target audience for the series was mainly older Japanese men, it worked back during the series' earlier days but times have changed and the series has taken only small steps in incorporating more female characters in positive roles. They have had a few standout female characters like Kaoru in Yakuza 2/Kiwami 2 and the debt collector who teaches you the Beast style in Yakuza 0 but it's a bit sad that as someone who's played all Yakuza games, I can only think of 2 standout characters.

Still though, as you said, at least they're trying.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Just another point about Yakuza, Nagoshi (head of the series, Chief Creative Offer for SEGA) is close friends with a transgender TV hostess/media personality and they host a stream about every month where they talk about SEGA's upcoming stuff and also bring on famous directors or comedians and musicians to talk about their stuff. Basically, they're not afraid to let transgender folk be part of the official face of the company. And also this:

This is some really neat additional context thank you. Do you know the name of the media personality or that stream at all? Would like to check it out as that's a really cool thing for a large games company to be doing over there.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
Heads up to Philadelphia as well. Good shit.
Signed on Thursday, the new laws require that youth organizations implement a policy that protects transgender or gender non-binary children from bullying and discrimination. City properties are also now required to provide a gender-neutral bathroom in all of their facilities.
 

lucebuce

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,836
Pakistan
This is some really neat additional context thank you. Do you know the name of the media personality or that stream at all? Would like to check it out as that's a really cool thing for a large games company to be doing over there.
This is her:

I don't remember where the stream happens (It's in Japanese and I think it's a niconico stream? Been months since I last tuned in) but yeah, it's been a thing for quite a fair amount of time. And I only JUST remembered that she is the same person who plays the transgender character in that image that I was responding to lol.

I remember that she's also been a host/MC for various companies' panels at the annual Tokyo Game Show too so it's not just SEGA that she's worked with.
 
Last edited:

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
On recommendation of the CaseyExplosion thread posted earlier, cozying up under a blanket for some Sunday chill. Soup and books. Mmmmmm.

 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148

This is her:

I don't remember where the stream happens (It's in Japanese and I think it's a niconico stream? Been months since I last tuned in) but yeah, it's been a thing for quite a fair amount of time. And I only JUST remembered that she is the same person who plays the transgender character in that image that I was responding to lol.

I remember that she's also been a host/MC for various companies' panels at the annual Tokyo Game Show too so it's not just SEGA that she's worked with.
This is all really great, thank you. So nice to hear of representation plus points over there.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
The end of the intro to the newly revised version of Gender Outlaws, posted above, is particularly poignant as an example of how to handle these things with care. I’ll type it up below, as honestly the way it wraps up puts a lump in my throat.

Encourage you all to read if you haven’t, also note the book was originally published in 1994. The snippet is from the intro to the Chinese translation but also forms the close of the intro in the home version.

- - - - - - - -

“When I first wrote this book language was a big problem. People knew about transexuals. But not many people were talking about the phenomenon of people who are neither men nor women, no matter how they choose to express their gender.To embrace those people (myself included), I borrowed the word transgender. But in many circles today, that word has become simply another word for transsexual — so in my country, the newer and more inclusive word is simply trans.

You will read words in this book that don’t ring true to you. Please, take a pen or pencil and cross them out. Write in a word you like better. And when that word doesn’t work for you anymore, use another word. The way of gender is a living, changing path, like a river — it does no one any good to try to keep either gender or a river still.

The language you discover may be useful to others, so please share it with them. Write blogs, poetry, drama and films that use your language for gender. Meet with other people who are finding their words, and discuss the value of language in the search for freedom and fluidity in gender. Your language may make others angry. Their language may make you laugh, that’s part of the fun.

Now, if anything you read in this book makes you feel bad or wrong or small and weak then please know I said something wrong. This book was written many years ago, and the culture I wrote it in is not the culture in which you’re reading it. So, if you find anything to be personally insulting, please accept my apology and keep reading with the knowledge that your gender identity and how you express your gender are correct only when you feel they are correct.

In closing, I’d like you to know that I’m writing this to you at the age of sixty-eight. I’m very old. I may very well be alive as you’re reading these words. But if I’m dead, I would be honoured if you call upon me as your ancestor in our mutual journey of gender exploration. I promise you that alive or dead, I will do all that’s in my power to help you find and live your destiny.

Much Love and Respect,
Kate Bornstein”
 

Bradbury

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,075
I'm buying some women clothes to try a new look for a party this week and it's my first break from mjne boring graphic tee and jeans look and I'm so excited. Thinking about trying some lipstick too
 

i love tacos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
38
I'm also reading Gender Outlaw due to the recommendation of CaseyExplosion. It's a really good read, helps me contextualize nonbinary people in history. This has also made me realize how woefully unprepared I am for the conversations that will almost certainly happen as I become more open in my expression and eventually ask for they/them pronouns. It _should_ be enough to share that this is my identity, but it won't be. I want to do my best to be able to speak credibly about it, both from my own experience and from an academic standpoint.

Once I'm done with this book I think I'll have to read Gender Trouble by Judith Butler. Anyone have recommendations for books or other media on gender identity?

I'm buying some women clothes to try a new look for a party this week and it's my first break from mjne boring graphic tee and jeans look and I'm so excited. Thinking about trying some lipstick too
This is great! Please let us know how it goes.
 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148


Losing stamina with this. Spend time patiently writing paragraphs to three people coming at us to police our upset, manage to turn their opinions and they apologise. But then the same thing happens the next page, and the next one, and the next one. For every single thread. Because the mods can’t even be fucked to do something like sticky a thread highlighting a problem even they acknowledge within it. Someone from outside the community that’s seen it enough times to go “uh, what the fuck?” and reach out to trans people for their feedback.

That posts saying trans people are being “too sensitive” about transphobic jokes are just given a slap on the wrist and even the most obvious “lol cancel culture” troll is given nothing to dissuade others from coming in and rewording the same one-line take that boils down to “you’re being too loud”.

Fuck is the actual point in posting in those threads anymore?
They’re derailed from page 2 and the rest of them is spent combatting the same arguments.
 
Last edited:

OniLinkPlus

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
600


Losing stamina with this. Spend time patiently writing paragraphs to three people coming at us to police our upset, manage to turn their opinions and they apologise. But then the same thing happens the next page, and the next one, and the next one. For every single thread. Because the mods can’t even be fucked to do something like sticky a thread highlighting a problem even they acknowledge within it. Someone from outside the community that’s seen it enough times to go “uh, what the fuck?” and reach out to trans people for their feedback.

That posts saying trans people are being “too sensitive” about transphobic jokes are just given a slap on the wrist and even the most obvious “lol cancel culture” troll is given nothing to dissuade others from coming in and rewording the same one-line take that boils down to “you’re being too loud”.

Fuck is the actual point in posting in those threads anymore?
They’re derailed from page 2 and the rest of them is spent combatting the same arguments.
Remember, it's not your job to correct them. You've put in the work and then some. If they're not going to listen, that's on them. What you've already done is amazing and appreciated.

I really wish more cis allies would actually stick up for us in those threads. Most of us don't have the energy to even begin to stand up for ourselves, given that's garbage we already have to deal with elsewhere, why would we want to voluntarily subject ourselves to more stress? If someone wants to be an ally, one of the simplest things they can do is stand up for us against transphobia and not let us fight alone.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,707
Yeah, I think I'm just gonna ignore that Contrapoints thread. Seeing things that get posted in it doesn't really help my mood.

In a more positive note, hey I made this thread about non-binary creators and it turned out super positive and pretty much everything I wanted it to be, and it makes much more sense to link it here than in that thread.

 

Kyuuji

Member
Nov 8, 2017
8,148
edit: On reflection..



Not going to feel guilty about being irritated for the stuff that goes on and level that against myself. I'll keep the pan lid on a bit better but there's only so much steam that can build up before some needs to burst out to bring it back down.
 
Last edited:
edit: On reflection..



Not going to feel guilty about being irritated for the stuff that goes on and level that against myself. I'll keep the pan lid on a bit better but there's only so much steam that can build up before some needs to burst out to bring it back down.
It's alright! I think you expressed the frustration most of us have here

i love tacos I have Gender Trouble on audio, I've listened to it several times, I hope it's not just my brain but to me it becomes psychological babble and I feel real bad I can't decipher it haaah....
 

Tezz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,055
I don't think I'm going to try to reason with anyone. Sometimes you gotta just say "ok boomer".