I think we should not expect the PS5 to dominate the market like the PS4 did

Afrikan

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,716
Microsoft did a good job of getting an audience to "switch" to the 360...then it was their job to keep most of those they got into their ecosystem. I don't know if the whole Red Ring situation got alot of them to switch back to (or for the first time try) the PS4, but we do know that the XboxOne Launch Strategy certainly did.

Now once Sony got all these customers, they did a good job of having exclusive content. So most of these customers who never owned PlayStations, might have been won over for another generation.

I think Xbox's hardcore fan base who also bought PS4s or felt they had to switch over... will go back to Microsoft next gen, IF they haven't already for the XboxOneX & GamePass.

I think the key is for Microsoft to attract more of the gaming audience DURING the generation...with blockbuster exclusive games. Like I've stated before, imo I think Ninja Theory with a huge budget will be part of that.

But I think it's going to be hard. Because this whole post I haven't said what Sony will do to keep most of that gaming audience. They will be ready with the exclusive games... they will be ready with a competitive price.

I think one thing that was learned/we were reminded from all this, is that if you do a great job of getting an audience..... you making fucking sure you are ready to keep them and don't do anything stupid to fuck up!
 

bane833

Member
Nov 3, 2017
4,309
Why not? If we look at the situation at the end of last gen Microsoft was in a much much better position than they are now. The 360 was a successful console almost worldwide, rivaling if not beating the PS3 in several markets. The Xbox One on the other hand is dead in the water outside of the US and UK, sales are at rock bottom (apart from some SAD firesales). On top of that you don´t even need the console to play Microsofts games anymore.
 

NZerker12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,041
As long as Microsoft treats Europe and the rest of the world as 2nd class they will never regain anything from Sony. I can only see them doing better in NA and that's it.
 

Scrawnton

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,221
OP, the PS4 launched in a very bad position. Sony's first party was struggling and the losses from the PS3/other Sony divisions were still keeping the company looking bloodied and battered even a couple of years after they were experiencing the initial success of the PS4. It took several years later of record breaking profit to get them back into the prime of PlayStation. And that's where they are as they are counting down to when they can reveal the PS5.

Sony didn't have to break much of a sweat to get to this position. They hardly moved the PS4's price, rarely relied on third party deals, and focused on growing their first party studios. Imagine if they are backed into a corner during the PS5 era? They have the money now to make some huge moves to gain momentum if necessary. Not only that, but several of their first party games are among the most anticipated across all next gen consoles.

I think they will dominate the way they did with the PS5 the same way they did with the PS4, but it will be more costly on them. That's about it.
How can you say that after the nonsense we went through with Destiny and Call of Duty this gen as well as tying down Kojima, hyping up the FF7 remake five years prior to release as a launch exclusive and then locking SFV down as a console exclusive?

Sony was very aggressive with third party deals this time around.
 

Arklite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,898
I don't think that will happen, and there's a very basic and simple reason as to why: the PS4 had the benefit of launching in a market with no viable competition.
This statement is complete hindsight, though. This is not how it appeared in 2013. Even with fan complaints, journalists were largely positive on Xbox One restrictions. The Wii U was looking slow, but to call it no competition woudl've been a huge stretch.

There's nothing to say this couldn't be the case now, where we all feel next gen is going to be highly competitive and then it just isn't.
 

ImaLawy3r

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Jun 6, 2019
619
Based on sentiment - which sucks as an indicator - I agree with you. PlayStation shit the bed when it came to consumer friendly practices in the last 2 years of this generation doesn't mean most people know that. Whereas, MS has been amazing with customer friendly practices but still in reality lacks games. Unless it's studio's can push out quality games or if they can do something even more amazing with xCloud - then I dunno. PS5 will still dominate, at least in raw numbers. Also MS fails year after year to penetrate the Asian market in any meaningful capacity. MS might win some mindshare, but its the games that matter.
 

McMoneyman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,786
Sweden
People focus on if PS5 will dominate the next gen or not.

I'm more interested in the battle of the OP makers: Phantom Thief vs Lant War.
 

xolsec

Member
Feb 18, 2018
1,685
Why not? If we look at the situation at the end of last gen Microsoft was in a much much better position than they are now. The 360 was a successful console almost worldwide, rivaling if not beating the PS3 in several markets. The Xbox One on the other hand is dead in the water outside of the US and UK, sales are at rock bottom (apart from some SAD firesales). On top of that you don´t even need the console to play Microsofts games anymore.
Good point, why do I need an Xbox in case they release a good game, if I have a gaming PC?
 

orochi91

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,146
Canada
Unless MS manages to penetrate global markets to the extent Sony has, I don't see why the PS5 won't be as successful as the PS4.
 

Manmademan

Member
Aug 6, 2018
7,368
The market fundamentals haven’t really changed though globally, XBOX is really strong in the USA and competing in a few Western Europe markets, but everywhere else they’ve made no progress at all. There are so many markets where Sony just dominates, and most of these are the ones that will provide the future growth in the market, so I don’t think they have anything to worry about.
Exactly. There's no plausible way the Xbox consoles get anywhere near the PS5 when sony has no competition across the vast majority of Europe and Asia.

Try to make the numbers work, you cant.

And for those pointing at the 360, that system sold 25 million units on the strength of Kinect, revitalizing sales near the end of the generation with consumers who are no longer in the market.

Without the Kinect Bump, the PS3 would have soundly beaten the 360 something like 85 million units to 60 million units.

And that was with EVERYTHING going right for Microsoft that possibly could have that gen and an extra year on the market to sell it.
 

mxbison

Member
Jan 14, 2019
2,050
Agree, I still think they will beat Xbox in overall sales though. The brand is just too far ahead in most regions.

Game Pass doesn't matter as much as people here think.
 

BlueManifest

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,607
I feel like PlayStation 5 will be the leading console of its generation, for a whole variety of reasons that at this point are well trodden territory:
  • PlayStation brand power
  • Sony's marketing and logistical infrastructure in major markets around the world
  • Sony's head start over Microsoft when it comes to great compelling exclusives that people will buy their console for
  • Sony's grasp over the console market, that has just ensured that they have not had a true failure in the console market yet
However, there is a difference between being the leading console (which PS5 will be) and being the dominant console (which PS4 was earlier in the gen), and on ResetEra, I often see a lot of people expecting PS5 to replicate the kind of immense and utter large scale market domination the PS4 exercised earlier in the gen.

I don't think that will happen, and there's a very basic and simple reason as to why: the PS4 had the benefit of launching in a market with no viable competition. Nintendo completely face planted with the biggest mainstream failure in console history, while Microsoft suffered from the worst messaging and marketing debacle in the console market of all time, which continues to plague Xbox One to this day. Sony had a clear field, the entire console market to themselves, for all practical purposes - and this, combined with their inherent strengths and advantages (as outlined above) led to the kind of utter domination we saw in the early years.

This is not to say that Sony got "lucky", or that they only won because the competition messed up. To reiterate (for the third time), Sony played their hand perfectly, and they were always going to win, no matter what, on the sheer inherent strength they have built up over the last two decades. I'm not handwaving their success as luck - I am saying the extent of their success definitely was influenced by the non-existence of any meaningful competition in the market at the time.

The PS5 launches in a vastly different market. Nintendo is resurgent, and has reasserted itself as a top seller with market-appealing exclusives. More importantly (in terms of direct competition), Xbox is in a far better position now than it was at the start of the generation. Microsoft has carefully studied its mistakes and put in the legwork to try and address the problems that took it down earlier this generation: they have purchased studios to bolster their first party, they have valuable offerings like Game Pass, plus initiatives like Play Anywhere amd BC to counter the image of them being "anti consumer"; even if Xbox ends up not doing well outside the anglosphere, in the Anglosphere, it will end up doing far better than the Xbox One did - and that success will obviously come at the expense of the PS5.

I still expect PS5 to "win" the generation in total - but I do think it won't outsell the competition as much as the PS4 did. i think a stronger Xbox will lead to Xbox clawing back some marketshare from PlayStation - enough that PS5 won't be dominant like the PS4 was (even though it will be the leader).
I actually don’t think it’s going to sell as good as the switch launch aligned but it will be close
 

DisturbedSwan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,147
Hampshire, UK.
Nah.

Microsoft is still soundly beaten in every other country apart from the US and that will continue in to Next Gen no matter what. Sony’s worst home console (PS3) still outsold the 360 worldwide mainly down to Europe and ROW sales.
 

MrH

Member
Nov 3, 2017
3,610
I dunno, they still have all the best exclusives, at least IMO. And with Microsoft putting out pretty much everything on PC these days I just don't see the point in owning an Xbox. Unless the new Xbox is massively better spec'd and runs all multiplats better then I just don't see Sony losing.
 

upinsmoke

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,861
I think it will be similar to this generation. The brand is too strong and it's in an even stronger position than in 2013. They dont need MS to put their foot in their mouth. That was only a tiny part. Look at the last 6-7 years and the last 25.
 

litebrite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,791
We cannot possibly know this though. We can predict that it might be, but people said the Xbox One would be just as good as the 360 and then it bombed. I'm not saying I think the PS5 will, but I think it's a bit early to say which one is going to be the leading console.
The Xbox One didn't bomb. I think it's obvious PS5 will be the leader at the start. Only time will tell how the generation ends.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,277
Ps4 wasn’t the dominating console “earlier in the gen” it is still. It sells more than Xbox and just recently fell behind switch, which makes sense 6 years into a gen. It’s past 100M and on track to end up 120-130M. It’s selling like 15M+ per year in lower years.

Could Xbox have a 360 level comback? Sure. But the European and Japanese markets are very different than 2005-10, so there are very few viable pathes to that outside of Sony fucking up tremendously.

ps4 has literally been 2.5 times ahead of Xbox the whole gen In terms “dominating” the market.That could change but atm there’s nothing to indicate it will.

no rumors of “no used games” or anything like for PS5, no reason to think that will change until something happens. If anything, Lockhart is the riskiest rumor and that’s Xbox. Could be huge, middling, or a dud
 

Shpeshal Ed

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,185
Melbourne, Australia
They’ll be the market leader by default thanks to BC. 100 million people aren’t Going to want to give up digital libraries very easily.

But the domination level won’t be near what it is this gen because Nintendo and Microsoft aren’t going out of their way to trip over their own feet this time.
 

litebrite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,791
I dunno, they still have all the best exclusives, at least IMO. And with Microsoft putting out pretty much everything on PC these days I just don't see the point in owning an Xbox. Unless the new Xbox is massively better spec'd and runs all multiplats better then I just don't see Sony losing.
Xbox has expanded beyond consoles. Judging next gen solely by who sold the most consoles will be outdated.
 

Philippo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,863
Milan, Italy
I'm sure that if by the end of next gen they sell 80-90mln consoles instead of 100 it won't disappointing to Sony as they will fill the void with other types of revenue (PS Plus, PS Now).
 

RingRang

Member
Oct 2, 2019
1,655
I agree with the premise that it’s not a matter of IF Sony wins next gen, it’s just a matter of by how much.

In terms of pure console sales though, while it’s true that Sony had weaker competition with the PS4, it’s also true that all the Xbox exclusives are now on PC day one, so I suspect Xbox console sales will be hurt by that.
 

Meatwad

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,532
USA
These are the kinds of things I don’t care about. I am not losing any sleep over whether or not Sony or MS or anybody else for that matter is “dominating”

Fact is PS5 will do well enough to get a large library of games and so will Xbox Scarlett and I think that’s all we need to be concerned with.
 

Prine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,937
Agreed, more so in EU as US was always close.

Feels like things will be much more even.
 

orochi91

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,146
Canada
Ps4 wasn’t the dominating console “earlier in the gen” it is still. It sells more than Xbox and just recently fell behind switch, which makes sense 6 years into a gen. It’s past 100M and on track to end up 120-130M. It’s selling like 15M+ per year in lower years.

Could Xbox have a 360 level comback? Sure. But the European and Japanese markets are very different than 2005-10, so there are very few viable pathes to that outside of Sony fucking up tremendously.

ps4 has literally been 2.5 times ahead of Xbox the whole gen In terms “dominating” the market.That could change but atm there’s nothing to indicate it will.

no rumors of “no used games” or anything like for PS5, no reason to think that will change until something happens. If anything, Lockhart is the riskiest rumor and that’s Xbox. Could be huge, middling, or a dud
+1

Well said.
 

SilverX

Member
Jan 21, 2018
3,759
How can you say that after the nonsense we went through with Destiny and Call of Duty this gen as well as tying down Kojima, hyping up the FF7 remake five years prior to release as a launch exclusive and then locking SFV down as a console exclusive?

Sony was very aggressive with third party deals this time around.
How is that relying on third party deals? Did you miss the Xbox 360 days where most major third party games had some form of exclusive content? Sony is guilty of resorting to the same tactics, but not to that extent. They clearly invested in their first party more than anything giving most their teams huge budgets and as many years as needed to create their games.
 

Elandyll

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,808
Holy crap you make a lot of threads man.
No kidding.

At times I have seen up to 4 threads by him on the front page, if not more.

About the "feeling" of the OP...
Ok?

Isn't this the nth thread on the subject of "Sony might repeat success, but not as much, because competitors won't screw up this time", which is basically a thinly veiled way to say the PS4's success is mostly due to competitors fumbling rather than Sony doing (nearly) everything right?

That position was, and still is, bullshit.
 

Dogui

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,537
I wouldn't say PS4 dominated the gen. Not like PS1/2 did atleast.

PS4 will probably get similar numbers to PS3 in the end, maybe 5m/10m more but that's it. PS5 will probably get something similar.

Next gen will be more like Nintendo trying to reach a former 7th glory and MS having new people to get PS numbers.

It's hard to know which console will lead next. A lot of stuff are happening in MS's ecosystem to just bet so safely on Sony. While Switch is getting only stronger as well.
 
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Fisty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,662
The only time Sony didn't dominate was when they blasted themselves into the sun in 2006. Feels like mid-term recency bias acting as if Sony dominating the market is abnormal
 

upinsmoke

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,861
Xbox has expanded beyond consoles. Judging next gen solely by who sold the most consoles will be outdated.
No it won't. A sale is a sale, whether it's a sub or a hardware purchase. If a business wants to report MAU's then fair enough but as long as hardware is being sold numbers will keep getting reported. Unless your getting soundly beaten of course where numbers could effect your brand image.
 

PianoBlack

Member
May 24, 2018
698
If 105 million PS4s vs 45-50 million XB1s is utter domination, what was 150 million PS2s vs 25 million OG Xboxes? They won this gen going away but it was hardly historic.
 

Scrawnton

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,221
How is that relying on third party deals? Did you miss the Xbox 360 days where most major third party games had some form of exclusive content? Sony is guilty of resorting to the same tactics, but not to that extent. They clearly invested in their first party more than anything giving most their teams huge budgets and as many years as needed to create their games.
I’m not saying Microsoft didn’t do it but let’s not pretend there weren’t some falls where Sony had no heavy hitter first party games and relied heavily on Destiny and CoD exclusives and marketing.