Democratic Presidential Primaries & Caucuses |March OT| Last Tuesday was 1000 years ago, old news no one cares about (Discussion Guidelines in OP)

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SilentSoldier

Member
Oct 27, 2017
437
Is it wrong to hope for a contested convention now in the hopes that delegates switch their votes for Bernie? In the wake of the coronavirus, it's pretty evident that progressive policies are what's needed. Or am I just wishful thinking?
 

TiC

Member
Jul 12, 2019
223
Is it wrong to hope for a contested convention now in the hopes that delegates switch their votes for Bernie? In the wake of the coronavirus, it's pretty evident that progressive policies are what's needed. Or am I just wishful thinking?
If that did happen, those delegates should swap to someone who is close in policy to Biden. That is the will of the voters they represent, the Biden voters.
 

Jiggy

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
5,623
wherever
Super cool that November is going to come down to which candidate assaulted less women

Is it wrong to hope for a contested convention now in the hopes that delegates switch their votes for Bernie? In the wake of the coronavirus, it's pretty evident that progressive policies are what's needed. Or am I just wishful thinking?
If the party decides it'll probably be someone like Cuomo or Klobuchar
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
12,987
I do think if there's a swap out it'll be someone that didn't run. Cuomo's fucking terrible beyond his COVID handling, but yeah... it'd be really easy to convince voters he's great since he has been getting national coverage and he has been handling covid extremely well. From a political, vote winning, perspective it's genius. From a "do I actually want this fucker to be President?" perspective? Noooooooooooooopppppppppppeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. I'd still prefer him to Biden.
 

Cheebo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,932
Ann Arbor, MI
Going by this thread you'd think this is a national news story and there was pressure to step down.

It didn't even make a blip on reddit, seemed to come and go fairly quickly on political twitter, and no major network or news site covered it.
 

emag

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,212
“The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”
 

Cheebo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,932
Ann Arbor, MI
God the media is gonna sit on this until the general then cover it a bunch for their horse race

I can just feel it
thats the thing...this story got NO attention today. Not by the news, not by reddit, not even social media. This "when will Biden step down" stuff only is a thing on this forum as far as I can tell. Otherwise the story came and went quickly without anyone taking notice of it. It didn't register in the news cycle at all.
 

danm999

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,930
Sydney
thats the thing...this story got NO attention today. Not by the news, not by reddit, not even social media. This "when will Biden step down" stuff only is a thing on this forum as far as I can tell. Otherwise the story came and went quickly without anyone taking notice of it. It didn't register in the news cycle at all.
This story will get more media coverage, the only question is when.
 

Addie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,829
D.C.
thats the thing...this story got NO attention today. Not by the news, not by reddit, not even social media. This "when will Biden step down" stuff only is a thing on this forum as far as I can tell. Otherwise the story came and went quickly without anyone taking notice of it. It didn't register in the news cycle at all.
I don't think it helps that the story is a link to someone's personal Soundcloud account, especially when it was released during both COVID-19 and the height of the COVID-19 relief bill -- which, honestly, is the bigger story right now.

A journalist writing the actual story would at least do some additional legwork, such as confirming employment histories, maybe reaching out to other people who were employed by Biden's staff during the same time period, etc. Obviously, they'd reach out to the BIden camp for comments too, and probably ask the accuser for a statement.

You just aren't going to see WaPo/NYT put up the Soundcloud link and say "this is it."
 

Sei

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,091
LA
So, we get to vote between two serial sexual offenders. Good one.

In the time when we need healthcare as a human right.
 

Addie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,829
D.C.
They’ll check out the provenance of it sure, but it’ll eventually seep through. I expect it to take a bit longer than the Bloomberg stuff did since COVID is still dominating headlines.
I suspect that process will be hastened when the dominos start to fall on people calling Biden to drop out -- whether that's Sanders surrogates and/or someone like Tulsi (or Amy?) vocally retracting her endorsement, who knows. But it's definitely not going away. You'd also think the Biden camp is planning on getting ahead of things.
 

Trey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,733
I do think if there's a swap out it'll be someone that didn't run. Cuomo's fucking terrible beyond his COVID handling, but yeah... it'd be really easy to convince voters he's great since he has been getting national coverage and he has been handling covid extremely well. From a political, vote winning, perspective it's genius. From a "do I actually want this fucker to be President?" perspective? Noooooooooooooopppppppppppeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. I'd still prefer him to Biden.
This is nut shit. Man tried for 3 cycles now to gin up enthusiasm for a presidential run. Ain't gifting him a spot at the table now.
 

mikeys_legendary

The Fallen
Sep 26, 2018
1,397
Legally, no. Socially? If there's credibility to the claim (there is) and the woman doesn't have some history of being a con artist (she doesn't) then yeah, we should believe her until proven otherwise. The justice system, politicians, and the media have long been enemies to the woman that accuse powerful men. If we took down Al Franken then Joe Biden is a no brainer.
I fundamentally disagree. I refuse to label someone a criminal because of an unproven accusation. However, I also do not believe women who come forward are to be treated as liars.

I've been wrongly accused of sexual assault and the social alienation surrounding that was so great I felt like I would die. Thankfully after the case was investigated my name was cleared...legally. but even to this day I have family members talking behind my back about how they feel that I did it.

I'm sorry but I refuse to automatically believe anyone for anything. I think accusations should be taken seriously, and they should be thoroughly investigated.
 

BADMAN

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,682

Go off King

I fundamentally disagree. I refuse to label someone a criminal because of an unproven accusation. However, I also do not believe women who come forward are to be treated as liars.

I've been wrongly accused of sexual assault and the social alienation surrounding that was so great I felt like I would die. Thankfully after the case was investigated my name was cleared...legally. but even to this day I have family members talking behind my back about how they feel that I did it.

I'm sorry but I refuse to automatically believe anyone for anything. I think accusations should be taken seriously, and they should be thoroughly investigated.
Okay, there's a difference between men in power getting accused and you getting accused.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
6,908
No that's fine, you just Kinda Believe Women, but need the patriarchal system to prove the guilt of the abuser before you can be sure about it.
"Believe Women" means you treat accusations as credible and investigate them without an initial bias against their credibility, it doesn't mean you don't investigate or accept the findings of an investigation. I have no idea where you got that idea, except maybe an alt-right "MRA" group railing against MeToo.
 

thewienke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,435
thats the thing...this story got NO attention today. Not by the news, not by reddit, not even social media. This "when will Biden step down" stuff only is a thing on this forum as far as I can tell. Otherwise the story came and went quickly without anyone taking notice of it. It didn't register in the news cycle at all.
Is the media even paying attention to anything Biden or Sanders are doing right now? Politically it's been the Trump and Cuomo show all orbiting the horrible COVID-19 news.
 

Breqesk

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,916
"Believe Women" means you treat accusations as credible and investigate them without an initial bias against their credibility, it doesn't mean you don't investigate or accept the findings of an investigation. I have no idea where you got that idea, except maybe an alt-right "MRA" group railing against MeToo.
'The courts can be trusted to credibly deal with cases of sexual assault.'

'A rapist sits on the US Supreme Court.'

Only one of these statements can be true.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
6,908
'The courts can be trusted to credibly deal with cases of sexual assault.'

'A rapist sits on the US Supreme Court.'

Only one of these statements can be true.
You can disagree with the findings of the court after an investigation has been conducted.

You cannot disagree with the findings of the court when an investigation has yet to be performed.

I don't know how this seems complicated for people: declaring the accused guilty sight-unseen is not appropriate behavior and is not recommended by the MeToo movement, it's exactly the sort of thing that makes MRA crazies look justified when they call it a "witch hunt" and it's exactly the sort of behavior that leads to debacles like the Johnny Depp situation.

Do believe her, treat her claims as credible, support and defend her. Do not instantly rush to crucify the accused without evidence or investigation. It's not difficult.
 

Breqesk

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,916
You can disagree with the findings of the court after an investigation has been conducted.

You cannot disagree with the findings of the court when an investigation has yet to be performed.

I don't know how this seems complicated for people: declaring the accused guilty sight-unseen is not appropriate behavior and is not recommended by the MeToo movement, it's exactly the sort of thing that makes MRA crazies look justified when they call it a "witch hunt" and it's exactly the sort of behavior that leads to debacles like the Johnny Depp situation.

Do believe her, treat her claims as credible, support and defend her. Do not instantly rush to crucify the accused without evidence or investigation. It's not difficult.
You're entirely missing the point. The system has proven itself to be unreliable, and corrupt to quite literally the highest possible level, so for all intents and purposes, it is fucking useless. If you can't trust the courts or the police in cases of sexual assault - and there are so very many good reasons not to - then why wait on an 'investigation'? It makes no practical difference.

Regardless, we're not talking about declaring formal, legal guilt sight unseen--we're talking about whether this man should be the Democrat nominee for president.
 

Znazzy

Member
Aug 27, 2018
687
Going by this thread you'd think this is a national news story and there was pressure to step down.

It didn't even make a blip on reddit, seemed to come and go fairly quickly on political twitter, and no major network or news site covered it.
Exactly. Some of these posts just read as desperate attempts to give Bernie the nomination, and it’s not going to happen.
"Believe Women" means you treat accusations as credible and investigate them without an initial bias against their credibility, it doesn't mean you don't investigate or accept the findings of an investigation. I have no idea where you got that idea, except maybe an alt-right "MRA" group railing against MeToo.
THANK YOU! That’s what so many people don’t understand.
 

MagicDoogies

Member
Oct 31, 2017
986
The US doesn't deserve Bernard Sanders.
They dont. The guy has zero skeletons in his closet and the only reason why hes getting so much vitriol is because despite the odds he keeps running and he refuses to drop out so some users here can 'coast' to the GE without having to seriously interrogate Joe Biden outside of softball gaffes.
Now they are trying to translate Bernies campaign failing with his entire career by making borderline false claims that hes all talk and no show. Its very interesting to see how people are dogpiling on misinformation about Joe Biden but Sanders being a blowhard is allowed to run rampant without so much as a warning.
 

Lentic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,834
Biden needs to drop out. This story isn’t going away. He raped a woman. Either we deal with this now or we deal with it in the general when the stakes are higher.
 

Lentic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,834
I feel like I am taking crazy pills. Where do you see this pressure coming from? It didn't make a blip on social media or the news at all. Similar to the accounts that came out in 2019.
The pressure is coming from him being a rapist.

It's going to get picked up eventually.The allegations that came before were just about inappropriate touching. This is straight up rape. If it doesn't get picked up now, it will be picked up by Fox News in the general.

Not holding Biden accountable now is a vote for Trump.
 
Last edited:
Oct 30, 2017
2,116
It may not have picked up traction today.
But it might.

The new is almost entirely about Covid-19.

Joe Biden's entire schtick is that he was Barack's VP and that he's running on a platform of character and decency.
Regardless of the validity or severity of allegations of serving the rich, demonizing the poor/youth/minorities, personal family dealings, unwanted touching, sexual assault, it's not a good look.

We can sit here and debate the merit of the talking points. We got to do that with Hillary, too. There were valid critiques and there were complete bullshit wild conspiracies about her.

A lot of people think Biden is a person of strong moral character. That's working for him now. But a lot can change.
 

ClockworkOwl

Member
Feb 1, 2020
40
It's sad how no one here has learned a lesson from the Johnny Depp situation. Believe women means take accusations seriously and treat the accusers with respect, but it does not mean immediately condemn the accused. The reasonable thing to do is to wait for proper media to vet this story and report on it themselves, but the simple truth is that so many people here already hate Biden so they want this story to be true.
 

Lentic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,834
Content warning: sexual assault
Absolutely heartbreaking to listen to this woman.

Biden drop out, you fucking piece of shit ghoul.
 
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